I didn’t even realize how much this guy was in the wrong until i noticed how many steps the victim took to get away from him. like he was trying to get away and he still got shot. may his soul rest easy tho

I didn’t even realize how much this guy was in the wrong until i noticed how many steps the victim took to get away from him. like he was trying to get away and he still got shot. may his soul rest easy tho

@Jon Osterman you're the one that called me out after the argument was already over and insulted me. Responding may not have been necessary but don't worry, I figured I'd explain to you why nothing you said contradicted anything anyways. If you still don't get that then you're just choosing to ignore the facts and arguing because you're upset that I disagree with you. If you don't think point of view is important there are thousands of cases for you to go find where it was ruled self defense because the person would reasonably percieve it that way from their point of view even when evidence shows that person wasn't in danger from a better and ultimately privileged point of view.

@Jon Osterman  except;

1, this guy was prone and his assailant was still standing

2, his assailant was from his point of view maneuvering to step behind him and towards him. That's where the subjective part becomes important btw, the point of view of the person in question claiming self defense is not only important, it's everything. He had to aim over his back, he did not have the privileged view that we do. Point of view is subjective because it relies on the position of the person in question. That person could not have seen what was happening from a disembodied overhead point of view like we did. He was after all, on the ground.

3, stand your ground isn't even necessary to apply to call it self defense, he was on the ground and thus unable to retreat so the only thing that matters is if from his point of view a reasonable person would percieve a threat on their life.

4, it wasn't remote, uncertain or contingent on anything as his assailant was less than 5 feet away and was stepping behind and towards him, had just thrown him to the ground in a surprise attack, and hadn't given any indication that if he did something specific he'd assault and kill him, the assault wasn't even clearly linked to any actions he had taken at this point, we only know why he did it after the fact.

5, I already agreed this guy deserved to go to jail after another commenter gave information that wasn't provided in this video that made it very clear way beyond what the video covered that this guy very likely was looking for a fight, so why don't you pay attention instead of continuing an argument that ended so long ago that you're not only late to the table, the bank is foreclosing on the mfing house and the guy you're looking for has already moved twice?

@Micheal Linne If it were about subjective threats, no one would ever be convicted because they could just use "I was scared" as a defense. That shit only works with cops because of qualified immunity and all that nonsense. The castle doctrine is NOT stand your ground, and there is more to it than duty to retreat. Only in stand your ground laws is there no longer any duty to retreat or refrain. But with castle, you cannot shoot a burglar who has surrendered to you, because it means they are no longer an imminent threat. This is absolutely objective too. It is not "oh, well, I certainly felt threatened, even though he was on his stomach with his hands behind his head." That doesnt work with castle doctrine, and depending on the prosecutors office, it might not work with stand your ground either. There is a very narrow legal definition of "imminent threat," which "means a condition of noncompliance that is reasonably certain to place life or limb in direct peril and is immediate and impending and not merely remote, uncertain, or contingent." That last part is particularly important here, and totally contradicts everything you just said. Perhaps you don't know more than me about law, perhaps because you didn't bother doing some basic googling. NOT MERELY REMOTE, UNCERTAIN, OR CONTINGENT. Get that through that thick skull of yours. it might save your ass someday from a manslaughter charge.

@Micheal Linne then ... why didn’t he..?<br>Woop- Didn’t see that this ended. Don’t reply.

@Micheal Linne then ... why didn’t he..?
Woop- Didn’t see that this ended. Don’t reply.

@Micheal Linne Mmk from what I saw on the camera footage he had a clear view of him and he was not charging toward him at all.

@Micheal Linne Mmk from what I saw on the camera footage he had a clear view of him and he was not charging toward him at all.

@Uuuh h I agree now but only because another commenter gave me more information that made it clear that this guy definitely deserves jail time. Context that wasn't in the video

@Uuuh h I agree now but only because another commenter gave me more information that made it clear that this guy definitely deserves jail time. Context that wasn't in the video

@Angela Halliwell yeah he's guilty. Or at least deserves to be in prison. I wish I'd known that sooner. There's no arguing with that.

@Angela Halliwell yeah he's guilty. Or at least deserves to be in prison. I wish I'd known that sooner. There's no arguing with that.

@Micheal Linne I checked , so TWO incidents where he was reported to police for physically threatening other road users with a gun, a further incident for which he was accused of Dangerous Driving by police after he deliberately caused a crash out of spite, and more interestingly a few  months earlier he has had a standoff over the same parking spot !! threatening to shoot the person parking in the handicap bay, and using racial slurs towards him...it's very much a pattern of behaviour,  , I get the uneasy feeling that that confrontation earlier that year was a form of "dress rehearsal" he was waiting for the right "opportunity"<br>See quote from Wikipedia ""Ricky Kelly, a male truck driver claims Drejka confronted him over parking his employer's tanker truck in the handicapped space. He accuses Drejka of threatening to shoot him and using a racial slur. The store owner Salous intervened and ordered Drejka to stop or else he would call the police, to whom Drejka replied, "I can't help myself, I keep getting myself into trouble." After the incident Drejka calls the company the driver works for and complains to the owner John Tyler, reportedly saying the driver was "lucky I didn't blow his head off." The driver reports this incident to the police in July after the shooting of Markeis McGlockton at the same location.

@Micheal Linne I checked , so TWO incidents where he was reported to police for physically threatening other road users with a gun, a further incident for which he was accused of Dangerous Driving by police after he deliberately caused a crash out of spite, and more interestingly a few  months earlier he has had a standoff over the same parking spot !! threatening to shoot the person parking in the handicap bay, and using racial slurs towards him...it's very much a pattern of behaviour,  , I get the uneasy feeling that that confrontation earlier that year was a form of "dress rehearsal" he was waiting for the right "opportunity"
See quote from Wikipedia ""Ricky Kelly, a male truck driver claims Drejka confronted him over parking his employer's tanker truck in the handicapped space. He accuses Drejka of threatening to shoot him and using a racial slur. The store owner Salous intervened and ordered Drejka to stop or else he would call the police, to whom Drejka replied, "I can't help myself, I keep getting myself into trouble." After the incident Drejka calls the company the driver works for and complains to the owner John Tyler, reportedly saying the driver was "lucky I didn't blow his head off." The driver reports this incident to the police in July after the shooting of Markeis McGlockton at the same location.

@Bella N you have to argue not only that he knew they were there but that he knew they were his.

@Bella N you have to argue not only that he knew they were there but that he knew they were his.

@Someone again i think it looked very different from the shooter's view point. I think that third step looked towards him and I think his torso was still towards him at that moment.

@Someone again i think it looked very different from the shooter's view point. I think that third step looked towards him and I think his torso was still towards him at that moment.

@Someone i agred with that last part assuming the shooter knew those kids were there and were this man's kids. If he knew then that throws self defense out the window because it seriously reduces the likely hood this man would have beat him because it was in front of his kids

@Someone i agred with that last part assuming the shooter knew those kids were there and were this man's kids. If he knew then that throws self defense out the window because it seriously reduces the likely hood this man would have beat him because it was in front of his kids

@Micheal Linne Gun is for life or death situations
Usually if u face danger, if u get shoved to ground
U Back down, call police
So untill the point to murdering someone
U have a bunch of things u could go to.
But if u see gun as the easy option so when u face any level of danger, u just shoot someone
It means, u r incapable of understanding the responsibility, controlling yourself, and judging a situation. It's the same for driving. If u r incapable of sensing when to stop, if u r too slow at reacting to sudden things, then it means u should not drive because u t putting other's life at danger.

@Vilesentry What are you even talking about. I never said it was justified or argued for it. I'm just saying that you went after someone's character for hypothetical situations that are made up by you. The whole "Bet you wish he shot his whole family too" rant you went on about is just baseless assumptions and you never challenged his argument, you just assume racism and used it as a crutch. Which is annoying to see. The case didn't have anything to do with race besides the fact that race exists in our civilization and the people in the confrontation were 2 different races.

@Bella N I must have missed the part he had said that but while that speaks to his character that doesn't make it not self defense. Another commenter gave me a new viewpoint on the matter though and I kind of agree with him that the man probably wouldn't have beat the shooter in front of his own kids so I think if we had proof the shooter had definitely known those kids were there and were this man's kids it would throw self defense completely out the window.

@Bella N I must have missed the part he had said that but while that speaks to his character that doesn't make it not self defense. Another commenter gave me a new viewpoint on the matter though and I kind of agree with him that the man probably wouldn't have beat the shooter in front of his own kids so I think if we had proof the shooter had definitely known those kids were there and were this man's kids it would throw self defense completely out the window.

@Micheal Linne U know that your argument doesn't make sense.
If someone is moving away from u, someone is moving away from u
Again, if u r that bad at judging threat, then ofcourse u should NOT have a gun. And if u r not trustable with a gun, then that means u should NOT have it.
If u r capable of hurting innocent ppl, at the first problem U face, it means u shouldn't have it.
That easy.

@Micheal Linne U know that your argument doesn't make sense.
If someone is moving away from u, someone is moving away from u
Again, if u r that bad at judging threat, then ofcourse u should NOT have a gun. And if u r not trustable with a gun, then that means u should NOT have it.
If u r capable of hurting innocent ppl, at the first problem U face, it means u shouldn't have it.
That easy.

@SIAED actually you have a good point. I didn't consider this would have been in front of his kids. I don't think that necessarily removes self defense though unless we can prove the shooter knew those kids were there and that they were this man's kids. If those two things are true I think that definitely changes things especially since it's not like this man had been verbally threatening him as it was all purely physical threats.

@SIAED actually you have a good point. I didn't consider this would have been in front of his kids. I don't think that necessarily removes self defense though unless we can prove the shooter knew those kids were there and that they were this man's kids. If those two things are true I think that definitely changes things especially since it's not like this man had been verbally threatening him as it was all purely physical threats.

@Micheal Linne also your whole argument is wrong. He gets shot in the third step. He doesn't even have time to do anything.
Sees the gun
One full step
Second full step
Third, his back is turned, still looking at the guy, u can see he is stepping forward, away from the suspect, and without being able to complete the third step he gets shot.
U can tell that the guy shoved to the ground wanted revenge. It's not brain surgery.

@Micheal Linne also your whole argument is wrong. He gets shot in the third step. He doesn't even have time to do anything.
Sees the gun
One full step
Second full step
Third, his back is turned, still looking at the guy, u can see he is stepping forward, away from the suspect, and without being able to complete the third step he gets shot.
U can tell that the guy shoved to the ground wanted revenge. It's not brain surgery.

@Jayden Yet you have no issue with the "uninformed assumption" the guy had that he was going to be attacked, which led to a man's death.

Seems like the only reason that wouldn't bother you is because you don't see him as a real person.

@Jayden Yet you have no issue with the "uninformed assumption" the guy had that he was going to be attacked, which led to a man's death.

Seems like the only reason that wouldn't bother you is because you don't see him as a real person.

@Storm™ it is impossible to know. I just think that third step would look from his point of view like he was coming back for more.

If we had evidence that he was yelling racial expletives at her or threatening her I would throw self defense out the window because that would constitute asking for violence and a readily present need for the man to use violence to defend his wife

@Storm™ it is impossible to know. I just think that third step would look from his point of view like he was coming back for more.

If we had evidence that he was yelling racial expletives at her or threatening her I would throw self defense out the window because that would constitute asking for violence and a readily present need for the man to use violence to defend his wife

@Micheal Linne Neither u, nor the suspect understand the scale of tragedy of someone getting killed in seconds in front of their family, and collapsing in front of their kid. <br>U can not hold that kind of a horror equal to being shoved or parking in a handicapped place.

@Micheal Linne Neither u, nor the suspect understand the scale of tragedy of someone getting killed in seconds in front of their family, and collapsing in front of their kid.
U can not hold that kind of a horror equal to being shoved or parking in a handicapped place.

@Angela Halliwell I'm not sure he actually brandished the firearm. People will see a holstered weapon and think its a threat, that doesn't make it brandishing the firearm. If there was picture or video evidence though I would have to agree that it speaks to his inability to safely handle a firearm

@Angela Halliwell I'm not sure he actually brandished the firearm. People will see a holstered weapon and think its a threat, that doesn't make it brandishing the firearm. If there was picture or video evidence though I would have to agree that it speaks to his inability to safely handle a firearm

@Micheal Linne Should be reported, okay
But the guy started walking around the car first, meaning he was already trying to engage. There is a chance she started first, but u can see that he is the one looking at her car, and going around it, so it's still no problem that she would ask him what he is doing.
And again, perspective doesn't give u rights to distort real footage, the guy took 3 steps back, it's common sense to use a gun for threat only, and attack only if u r actually getting attacked, if u r incapable of understanding a man who took 3 steps back is backing down, then you should NOT have a gun. If u r incapable of controlling yourself under pressure, u should NOT have a gun.
And lastly, ofcourse having kids matter. If u r that innocent of a person, u would think at least twice before shooting someone, u would think a million times before shooting someone in front of their family and kids.
The victim did wrong by attacking so violently, but it can by no means justify the guy shooting him.

@Micheal Linne Exactly. I feel like it has been turned into a race issue as much as this has.

@Micheal Linne Exactly. I feel like it has been turned into a race issue as much as this has.

@Mimi Adams road rage often entails exiting the vehicle. It doesn't usually go reported when people stay in their vehicles

@Mimi Adams road rage often entails exiting the vehicle. It doesn't usually go reported when people stay in their vehicles

@B49ify when did he say something racist? Was that even alleged?

@B49ify when did he say something racist? Was that even alleged?

@Jayden that kid had such impressive levels of self control, he didn't shoot a single person who wasn't clearly from any point of view trying to hit him over the head with something, pinning him against a wall while trying to wrestle his gun away from him, or leveling off to shoot him while he couldn't get away. It doesn't get more self defense than that.

@Jayden that kid had such impressive levels of self control, he didn't shoot a single person who wasn't clearly from any point of view trying to hit him over the head with something, pinning him against a wall while trying to wrestle his gun away from him, or leveling off to shoot him while he couldn't get away. It doesn't get more self defense than that.

@Someone it doesn't matter if he had 3 kids or 100 kids, he started the violence and I think it would look like he was coming back for more from the shooter's point of view

@Someone it doesn't matter if he had 3 kids or 100 kids, he started the violence and I think it would look like he was coming back for more from the shooter's point of view

@Someone I've been corrected about the disabled part, apparently it was his stepmother, either way I think it should be documented and reported when someone illegally parks in disabled parking. Also I said at best we can't tell who spoke first though I do think it was probably her, I was just pointing out that you can't tell when the window was rolled down and decided it's pointless to get into a he said she said so I just decided to believe she spoke first because that's what it looks like to me.

@Someone I've been corrected about the disabled part, apparently it was his stepmother, either way I think it should be documented and reported when someone illegally parks in disabled parking. Also I said at best we can't tell who spoke first though I do think it was probably her, I was just pointing out that you can't tell when the window was rolled down and decided it's pointless to get into a he said she said so I just decided to believe she spoke first because that's what it looks like to me.

@Bob that's my whole point. I think the third step where he gets shot would look like a step at the shooter from the shooter's point of view

@Bob that's my whole point. I think the third step where he gets shot would look like a step at the shooter from the shooter's point of view

@Micheal Linne The fact you're justifying what was obviously murder speaks volumes on your psych. Go get help before you end up being the guy in one of these videos

@Micheal Linne The fact you're justifying what was obviously murder speaks volumes on your psych. Go get help before you end up being the guy in one of these videos

@Razvan Nestor none of us use our real names for accounts, or at least I hope so. I don't know if I would have shot, I personally wouldn't have gotten into or continued that argument, but if I had and had been shoved I'd hope that I'd be able to tell he was surrendering because I like everyone else would rather not take a life if I don't have to and would hope I never feel like I have to. If I had taken the shot I'd hope I wouldn't lie to the police about things like he did and I'd hope I would remember to ask for a lawyer before speaking to them in the first place. He was so focused on trying to protect their perception of him he got rid of his legitimate claim to self defense and frankly cost himself his case.

@Ronnie Heuveltje I was actually kinda corrected on the disabled part, it's either that both he and his step mom are disabled or just his step mom because he brought up his step mom as one reason he didn't like people parking illegally in the disabled parking. People are saying it was just a pet peeve but also I think people should report illegal disabled parking, it's one of the scummyest things you can do.

@Ronnie Heuveltje I was actually kinda corrected on the disabled part, it's either that both he and his step mom are disabled or just his step mom because he brought up his step mom as one reason he didn't like people parking illegally in the disabled parking. People are saying it was just a pet peeve but also I think people should report illegal disabled parking, it's one of the scummyest things you can do.

@Ben Smith definitely. I think everyone probably should go to therapy. That's how we stop exploited and unhappy people from exploding some day when they decide they've had enough and the pressure has become too much. Its a way better solution than just telling people to suck it up

@Ben Smith definitely. I think everyone probably should go to therapy. That's how we stop exploited and unhappy people from exploding some day when they decide they've had enough and the pressure has become too much. Its a way better solution than just telling people to suck it up

@LesbianWitchAcademia also he took a step towards and behind the shooter with his torso facing him on the third step and wasn't shot until that exact moment. The shooter had to aim over his back and had a limited field of view and not the privileged one we enjoyed ergo self defense

@LesbianWitchAcademia also he took a step towards and behind the shooter with his torso facing him on the third step and wasn't shot until that exact moment. The shooter had to aim over his back and had a limited field of view and not the privileged one we enjoyed ergo self defense

@LesbianWitchAcademia he would have reported it to the police with pictures if either she hadn't rolled down her window to talk to him or he hadn't ambushed him from behind. I think people should report illegal disabled parking, you can't get much scummyer than doing that.

@LesbianWitchAcademia he would have reported it to the police with pictures if either she hadn't rolled down her window to talk to him or he hadn't ambushed him from behind. I think people should report illegal disabled parking, you can't get much scummyer than doing that.

@Micheal Linne I think the one thing you're not paying attention to at all is the more emotional side of things. Because I highly doubt that the victim was going actually start beating him up in broad daylight with a bunch of spectators including some of his kids.

If anything, he would have yelled some more at the perp and then either gone back to his business(more likely) or helped him to his feet(less likely).

And this is all besides the fact that the  perp shot a man with a family despite having time to really think over his decision.

@Micheal Linne I think the one thing you're not paying attention to at all is the more emotional side of things. Because I highly doubt that the victim was going actually start beating him up in broad daylight with a bunch of spectators _including some of his kids._

If anything, he would have yelled some more at the perp and then either gone back to his business(more likely) or helped him to his feet(less likely).

And this is all besides the fact that _the  perp shot a man with a family despite having time to really think over his decision._

@Uuuh h "defending" I presume. He took a step forward and behind a guy that was aiming over his back because he had just been violently thrown to the ground and his torso was still facing him. That would look like coming at him from the shooter's point of view.

@Uuuh h "defending" I presume. He took a step forward and behind a guy that was aiming over his back because he had just been violently thrown to the ground and his torso was still facing him. That would look like coming at him from the shooter's point of view.

@Micheal Linne Seeing as how there's no audio, it is impossible for us to know the tone of the conversation. Assuming voices were raised, and the assailant, and victim in this situation, the man who was shot fatally, may have acted proportionally if he believed his wifes and children's life was in danger, the shooter, who claims to have acted in self defense did not react proportionally to being pushed, and clearly excessive force was used simply because it was available to him. The fact that he shot him after walking three steps apparently away from him, and according to his own account shows that he was note acting whole heartedly and entirely in self defense.

@Ben Smith yeah, other countries just deny that their people are dying and how because they're afraid of the sensitive subject🤣🤣. Self defense has to be protected or else you just tell people to accept their fate and die or spend their life in prison if their attacked

@Ben Smith yeah, other countries just deny that their people are dying and how because they're afraid of the sensitive subject🤣🤣. Self defense has to be protected or else you just tell people to accept their fate and die or spend their life in prison if their attacked

@Bella N the situation is horrible, that doesn't make it not self defense

@Bella N the situation is horrible, that doesn't make it not self defense

@annabanananaaaa it's entirely different from parking in disabled parking also, he approached the car long before knowing anyone was inside let alone who was so no I don't think it was racially motivated. If you assume that just because they did happen to be black, that means he must be racist than I'm afraid you are the racist.

@annabanananaaaa it's entirely different from parking in disabled parking also, he approached the car long before knowing anyone was inside let alone who was so no I don't think it was racially motivated. If you assume that just because they did happen to be black, that means he must be racist than I'm afraid you are the racist.

@annabanananaaaa it's actually a bad idea to try to give a verbal warning most of the time especially in up close situations because speaking forces you into a moment of hesitation and being unfocused and you'd be unable to pull the trigger if that person had reached for your gun or kicked you in the head. Talking only gives your attacker an opportunity. Some attackers may know and use this but also attackers sometimes just do it without even knowing this information.

I wish he would have given a verbal warning in this case or if his attacker had said something like we're good man, no need to shoot or something because at least then there would have been a better chance the shooter could have realized he was in fact backing off and also verbally warning him may have prompted a response to take an action that would more visibly signify surrender like say put your hands up or don't move could have lead to compliance that would clearly pointed to the shift from chaos to control of the situation.

Also it's not really about severity of the actual crime of parking in a disabled parking lot, I think people absolutely should take pictures and report illegal parking in disabled parking spots, it's one of the scummyest things someone can do.

@Micheal Linne who are you trying to kid, he wasn't exactly quoting love poetry to her 🙄..the body language is clear to see in the video, he was trying to intimidate the woman, seeing her as an easy target ...the guy has form, he had on at least FIVE different occasions (that we know of, likely more) brandished a firearm in road rage incidents...this was part of a pattern of well established behaviour, but this time he shot and killed his victim in front of both CCTV and eye witnesses

@Micheal Linne who are you trying to kid, he wasn't exactly quoting love poetry to her 🙄..the body language is clear to see in the video, he was trying to intimidate the woman, seeing her as an easy target ...the guy has form, he had on at least FIVE different occasions (that we know of, likely more) brandished a firearm in road rage incidents...this was part of a pattern of well established behaviour, but this time he shot and killed his victim in front of both CCTV and eye witnesses

@Higai you carry a gun in case you need to defend yourself. You may not realize it but you generally don't hear about the mass shootings that are stopped by civilians defending themselves with guns, nor do you hear about robberies stopped by gun owners, nor do you hear about violent gang attacks stopped by gun owners. All you ever hear about is shootings that weren't stopped. If gun owners didn't ever carry their guns on them, that's all there would ever actually be.

@Higai you carry a gun in case you need to defend yourself. You may not realize it but you generally don't hear about the mass shootings that are stopped by civilians defending themselves with guns, nor do you hear about robberies stopped by gun owners, nor do you hear about violent gang attacks stopped by gun owners. All you ever hear about is shootings that weren't stopped. If gun owners didn't ever carry their guns on them, that's all there would ever actually be.

@Micheal Linne sitting in a car, his holstered gun would not be visible to people in other cars.

@Micheal Linne sitting in a car, his holstered gun would not be visible to people in other cars.

@Storm™ that's fair enough but the question becomes if that constitutes a situation where you should expect to be ambushed and are therefore provoking violence against you.

@Storm™ that's fair enough but the question becomes if that constitutes a situation where you should expect to be ambushed and are therefore provoking violence against you.

@Chris Marklowitz he stepped in and behind him on the 3rd step and hadn't been shot until that moment. Our point of view was privileged and we have to consider that this man had to aim over his back and make that decision with a much more limited field of view

@Chris Marklowitz he stepped in and behind him on the 3rd step and hadn't been shot until that moment. Our point of view was privileged and we have to consider that this man had to aim over his back and make that decision with a much more limited field of view

@Bruokoli one kick to the head and he would have died. Or if he just hit his head when he fell. He was going to continue the beating until he had drawn the gun, if he hadn't he'd very likely have been the one in a coffin. The matter of self defense comes after though and it hangs entirely on wether you believe that from the shooters perspective it would be reasonable to believe he was stepping forward to continue the beating and from the shooter's perspective I do believe that's the case as he was aiming over his back and could only watch the man's leg and torso which were both towards him as the leg moved towards him

@Bruokoli he stepped towards and behind him on the third step and kept his torso pointed towards him, that's enough in my opinion

@Bruokoli he stepped towards and behind him on the third step and kept his torso pointed towards him, that's enough in my opinion

@Mimi Adams so that's what the other guy was talking about. Apparently I missed that. If that's true then it definitely speaks about this man's general inability to make sound decisions about gun safety. At the same time though people act like seeing a holstered gun is threatening people with that gun so I could see someone reporting falsely that he waved it around just because of road rage if he just had it on him at the time. Had they provided a picture or video of this behavior?

@Mimi Adams so that's what the other guy was talking about. Apparently I missed that. If that's true then it definitely speaks about this man's general inability to make sound decisions about gun safety. At the same time though people act like seeing a holstered gun is threatening people with that gun so I could see someone reporting falsely that he waved it around just because of road rage if he just had it on him at the time. Had they provided a picture or video of this behavior?

@bornstandin he's in prison because he both lied to to make him appear in better standing to the police, and talked to the police in general without council there to advise him not to make false, exaggerated or reductive statements or to just not say certain things in general.

@bornstandin he's in prison because he both lied to to make him appear in better standing to the police, and talked to the police in general without council there to advise him not to make false, exaggerated or reductive statements or to just not say certain things in general.

@Noah Housh is it reasonable to shoot somebody over a parking space?

@Noah Housh is it reasonable to shoot somebody over a parking space?

@Noah Housh well the court decided who was wrong

@Noah Housh well the court decided who was wrong

@Oklahoma southerner except he made a third step towards and behind him after those 2 steps back and it was only then that he was shot. The biggest reason he lost his trial was because he was too stupid to ask for a lawyer before trying his best to convince the cops it was necessary when the cops will only ever use what you say against you in court even if you fabricate parts in order to make yourself appear better and the truth would have happened to give you a better defense. He stated he was watching his feet because that's what training taught him he was supposed to do, but he was aiming over his back, there was no way he could have seen the guys feet but what he could see was leg moving towards him, upper torso pointed towards him. It would have been better for his defense if he told the truth instead of trying to convince the cop that through virtue of his training it could only have been self defense because his training might suggest he knew how to identify a threat and what he saw specifically constituted that threat but then he added in details he couldn't have seen like the man's feet.

A lot of debate going on here. My biggest take away is you get assholes who create problems and get into confrontational predicaments regularly. When you disrespect someone's partner, a lot of the time, you will get a rise.

I know people are saying he didn't have the right to push him, legally, but in a lot of cases that's what will happen in a situation like this. And confrontations like this happen everywhere, all across the world and all of the time.

However, in most other countries, you don't have a significant portion of society carrying a firearm.

@G Victor but it's all good though, you'll get yours💯

@G Victor but it's all good though, you'll get yours💯

@Angela Halliwell except he didn't start a shouting match, it's debatable wether he even spoke first and also he was going to just take pictures and report them until he got into that argument and was violently ambushed

@Angela Halliwell except he didn't start a shouting match, it's debatable wether he even spoke first and also he was going to just take pictures and report them until he got into that argument and was violently ambushed

@Jon Osterman well in the us we have what's called a castle doctrine which means we don't have a duty to retreat in our own homes. Also this man couldn't retreat because he was laying on the ground and the imminent threat was his attacker stepping towards and behind him. Perhaps I know how that law works better than you because it actually isn't about objective levels of danger it's about subjective levels of danger. If someone is running towards you and looking at you angrily and focused and reaching for something for example, you don't have to take into consideration whatever they might be reaching for because you may not see it until it's too late. That's a deadly threat even without the context of being violently thrown to the ground first. That person could be handing you a summons, but so long as the item they're reaching for is unclear, you have any reason to believe your life might be in danger, and they are targeting you, shooting them would be self defense if you couldn't retreat. Say you were a paraplegic sitting on a park bench with your wheelchair too far out of reach for you to grab it and get away for example.

Well this guy's attacker took a step towards him from his point of view, its the same principle as reaching for something, it doesn't matter what they are stepping towards you for or reaching for so long as you have a reasonable belief the purpose is to assault and seriously harm you, like you know, right after having thrown you to the ground and potentially killing you.

@Jon Osterman Most people that see a burglar in their home won't give them a chance to surrender. I can't say that "imminent threat" is subjective but at the same time, an imminent threat may be different to everyone. Look at Kyle Rittenhouse, a case where a lot of people believe he murdered 2 people just because the media created a narrative when in reality it was the most textbook case of self defense, possibly in the history of self defense.

@Jon Osterman Most people that see a burglar in their home won't give them a chance to surrender. I can't say that "imminent threat" is subjective but at the same time, an imminent threat may be different to everyone. Look at Kyle Rittenhouse, a case where a lot of people believe he murdered 2 people just because the media created a narrative when in reality it was the most textbook case of self defense, possibly in the history of self defense.

@Vilesentry People like you make every situation worse. All of this is off of uninformed assumptions that can't be proven one way or another.

@Vilesentry People like you make every situation worse. All of this is off of uninformed assumptions that can't be proven one way or another.

@Micheal Linne if u r not trained enough to not just randomly shoot someone the moment u panic, then u shouldn't have a gun in the first place.
So by now we got
1. Not disabled
2. Aggressive
3. Parked in illegal spot himself
4. Shouldn't have a gun
5. Shot a guy who was clearly stepping away, the only reason he was unsure for a split second was bc his wife was still near the psycho.
He took 3 steps back, then stumbled for a split second, which u can tell it's bc his wife and kids r near the car dammit.
6. The suspect was there long enough to know ab kids

@Micheal Linne You are changing your own arguments. In the beginning u said "we can't be sure who spoke"
And then u said "by confronting someone, who talked first by the way!"
Also, that "douchebag" has 3 kids
The suspect is not disabled
And his behavior from the very beginning is aggressive.

@Micheal Linne You are changing your own arguments. In the beginning u said "we can't be sure who spoke"
And then u said "by confronting someone, who talked first by the way!"
Also, that "douchebag" has 3 kids
The suspect is not disabled
And his behavior from the very beginning is aggressive.

@Micheal Linne It's common sense to use a gun as a threat. You don't just pull it out and shoot immediately. There is nothing to defend.

@Micheal Linne It's common sense to use a gun as a threat. You don't just pull it out and shoot immediately. There is nothing to defend.

@Micheal Linne Fair point about him pushing the guy, that seemed pretty unnecessary. But once he had a gun trained on him and was taking several steps back he stopped being a serious threat. I don't really see a justified killing here, but it could've looked different from his perspective.

@Micheal Linne Fair point about him pushing the guy, that seemed pretty unnecessary. But once he had a gun trained on him and was taking several steps back he stopped being a serious threat. I don't really see a justified killing here, but it could've looked different from his perspective.

@MrManic52001 I have a weird feeling if it was a white guy who pushed another man to defend his family you wouldn’t use the term thug.

@MrManic52001 I have a weird feeling if it was a white guy who pushed another man to defend his family you wouldn’t use the term thug.

@Micheal Linne agree both men way overreacted.   but did he say was disabled ?   he doesnt look it.   All about him seems he just want to bully someone .

@Micheal Linne agree both men way overreacted.   but did he say was disabled ?   he doesnt look it.   All about him seems he just want to bully someone .

@Micheal Linne You need help, you should go to therapy.

@Micheal Linne You need help, you should go to therapy.

@Micheal Linne It wasn't just "confronting" tho. Witnesses in the building referred to it as a loud argument, which generally translates to a screaming match. It doesn't matter if someone is taking the disabled spot. It's not on you as a citizen to confront someone over it, especially a woman who looks to be by herself in the car with a child there, and especially not screaming at her. Her boyfriend was honestly completely justified in pushing the guy over and away from his girlfriend, as he obviously posed a threat to her. You don't just pull a gun on someone because you got pushed for being an asshole, and you especially don't fucking shoot it at someone when they're obviously backing away because you have a fucking gun pulled on them.

@Bella N crying over the internet wont bring the black dude back from the dead

@Bella N crying over the internet wont bring the black dude back from the dead

@Micheal Linne Also, you say it’s “disgusting” to park illegally in a disabled spot when you’re not disabled but seem to have no problem with the illegal parking of the guy who then went on to harass a woman with her children. I’m sure it has nothing to do with the skin colour that you still think the white guy is in the right for killing a man and traumatising a whole family - just cause someone parked wrong and then someone was shoved cause they’re provoking a confrontation that could’ve been handled in a peaceful manner. You’re also not wondering why this guy walked up to a black woman and her kids with a gun on him. Yep, you’re totally not racist. 😂

@Micheal Linne oh and parking in a disabled spot is not a crime, it’s a violation at best. You’re trying to justify cold blooded murder and it’s making me worried for the community you live in, if you think that’s an okay way to handle confrontation.

@Micheal Linne oh and parking in a disabled spot is not a crime, it’s a violation at best. You’re trying to justify cold blooded murder and it’s making me worried for the community you live in, if you think that’s an okay way to handle confrontation.

@Micheal Linne so you don’t think pointing your gun and giving him a warning would have been enough to stop the other guy from attacking? Did he really have to kill him dead? Just cause he’s disabled? I agree that you shouldn’t shove someone just like that but it does not justify murder. Y’all not living in the Wild West  anymore, it’s the 21st century! But then again, I’m just a European who doesn’t get this whole gun fetish...

@Micheal Linne so you don’t think pointing your gun and giving him a warning would have been enough to stop the other guy from attacking? Did he really have to kill him dead? Just cause he’s disabled? I agree that you shouldn’t shove someone just like that but it does not justify murder. Y’all not living in the Wild West  anymore, it’s the 21st century! But then again, I’m just a European who doesn’t get this whole gun fetish...

@Enter the Abyss black shoved disabled man first, he escalated it to assault. Disabled man shot in self defense afraid for his life.

@Enter the Abyss black shoved disabled man first, he escalated it to assault. Disabled man shot in self defense afraid for his life.

@Micheal Linne while I see your point that he shouldn’t have shoved a disabled man
1) why confront the victim’s wife with aggression
2) if you saw some guy screaming at your wife, you’d be pissed so rationality and patience goes out the window
3) why in the FUCK did this man have a firearm on him, he didn’t get it from his car, he had it in his person for whatever reason (I don’t give a fuck if “it’s his right to own a gun”, why would you go outside with a fucking firearm just use a taser or pepper-spray)
4) this man made the victim’s son see his father’s life fade away, in front of him

I dont care how you pin it, Michael was in the wrong for killing the victim and hopefully he thinks twice or thrice before opening fire because he couldnt handle a shove after yelling at another man’s woman

@Iridium Apple Absolutely. Just say "what's the problem bro?"
Hot head 1 turned it into a fight, and hot head 2 murdered him.
Don't be a hot head kids.

@Iridium Apple Absolutely. Just say "what's the problem bro?"
Hot head 1 turned it into a fight, and hot head 2 murdered him.
Don't be a hot head kids.

@Micheal Linne you make a lot of assumptions. I'm not offended, I'm arguing for justice. I don't believe this was racially motivated, although the confrontation with the mother, before the shooting, was instigated by him as he was the individual whom came up to another individuals vehicle and proceeded to circle it and then wait around until noticed and asked why he was there.

@Micheal Linne you make a lot of assumptions. I'm not offended, I'm arguing for justice. I don't believe this was racially motivated, although the confrontation with the mother, before the shooting, was instigated by him as he was the individual whom came up to another individuals vehicle and proceeded to circle it and then wait around until noticed and asked why he was there.

yea he was physically in the wrong but its hard to know what he was actually thinking. Its possible he just wasnt thinking right since he had just hit the ground.

yea he was physically in the wrong but its hard to know what he was actually thinking. Its possible he just wasnt thinking right since he had just hit the ground.

@Micheal Linne Na it was clear from the footage there was plenty of time between when the man was pushed to where he was shot and he was clearly standing or retreating. Not following up and attacking

@Micheal Linne Na it was clear from the footage there was plenty of time between when the man was pushed to where he was shot and he was clearly standing or retreating. Not following up and attacking

He just had to take the gun out he didn't have to fire it. come on

He just had to take the gun out he didn't have to fire it. come on

Victim? You mean the guy who assaulted him and provoked the entire situation/ Go to hell.

Victim? You mean the guy who assaulted him and provoked the entire situation/ Go to hell.

Your right. Unarmed and in the interview he cited the only thing he noticed was the man was black.

Your right. Unarmed and in the interview he cited the only thing he noticed was the man was black.

He was standing over him being a thug when he shot him. Then ran away after he'd been shot. He wouldn't have run off otherwise, he would have stayed there to stomp him out.

He was standing over him being a thug when he shot him. Then ran away after he'd been shot. He wouldn't have run off otherwise, he would have stayed there to stomp him out.

Did you catch the part where Drejka had, in the past, threatened other drivers during road rage incidents with his gun (including a woman with kids in her car)? Wonder how he justified that to himself. Other people in this thread can make all the unfounded excuses for him that they want, but your comment shows that you see the picture clearly.

Did you catch the part where Drejka had, in the past, threatened other drivers during road rage incidents with his gun (including a woman with kids in her car)? Wonder how he justified that to himself. Other people in this thread can make all the unfounded excuses for him that they want, but your comment shows that you see the picture clearly.

@ментыdestroyer Pulling the gun isn't the problem.  And if he had shot while the guy was still coming forward, I doubt he would have been convicted.  But he didn't.  He waited until the guy was backing away and then shot him.  That isn't self defense, by definition.

@ментыdestroyer Pulling the gun isn't the problem.  And if he had shot while the guy was still coming forward, I doubt he would have been convicted.  But he didn't.  He waited until the guy was backing away and then shot him.  That isn't self defense, by definition.

@Micheal Linne no, I also carry my FMK 9mm on me always everywhere and when you carry, you do not start a conflict, confrontation, arguments ect. He should have just went in and told the store manager and let them handle it from there. When you carry a gun you must know where the very very thin line between self defense and murder is, and you can see it in the video. When the victim took two steps back and not forward, he was showing he no longer was a deadly threat, now should he had pushed him NO, but all this could have been avoided, if the shooter did believe he had the right to confront the woman and escalated the situation.

@NeoSaurfang at this point the wife had just got out the car, , the husband saw a fat stranger harassing his wife, , ➡ in most places the guy would have been pushed away from any man's wife.

@NeoSaurfang at this point the wife had just got out the car, , the husband saw a fat stranger harassing his wife, , ➡ in most places the guy would have been pushed away from any man's wife.

@Micheal Linne the killer was NOT disabled . Any "self defense is required to be reasonable and proportionate.. frankly the killer started it from starting a shouting match with his victim's wife.

@Micheal Linne the killer was NOT disabled . Any "self defense is required to be reasonable and proportionate.. frankly the killer started it from starting a shouting match with his victim's wife.

@Micheal Linne So like, I'm not going to come into this trying to actually argue against your points, because you've made your stubbornness concerning where you stand on the matter extremely clear.

But just fucking imagine actually defending someone who shot an unarmed person.  It doesn't fucking matter who started it, it doesn't fucking matter if the person who shoved him down was going to start beating him up, you don't just pull a glock on someone and open fire. You're literally escalating the confrontation for no reason.

I will say that the person who shoved him shouldn't have done so. That was wrong. But the fact that his response in any capacity is to just pull out a gun and shoot a bullet into the victim is just wrong on so many levels. I hope he had his license to carry revoked(if he even had one in the first place) and his firearm(s) confiscated.

I just find the fact that you're actually defending this guy sickening.

Wow you sure do enjoy running your mouth. Problem is, you don’t understand what “imminent threat” means. It is not some subjective thing that yo get to decide on, it’s a threat that must be real, not simply perceived, and would occur in an immediate time frame, and the most important part, “could result in death or serious bodily harm.” This legal definition is quite narrow, and all criteria must be met, not just one or two. People like you keep spreading this false narrative that if you catch a burglar in your home you have the right to shoot them. You confuse duty to retreat with criteria to imminent threat. If the burglar surrenders and is no longer an imminent threat, you can’t shoot them unless they do something to again become an imminent threat. And I really don’t know why you’re on here arguing with every single person. Doesn’t make me very confident that you understand law very well.

@KuariThunderclaw what verbal abuse did he throw though? We didn't see any of that. He didn't even talk to her until she talked to him first.

@KuariThunderclaw what verbal abuse did he throw though? We didn't see any of that. He didn't even talk to her until she talked to him first.

@sean ajolo I thought so at first but now its unclear. He said something about what if his step mom was there according to someone else. But even if he wasn't disabled, calling someone out on doing something as deuchy as parking in a disabled parking space doesn't warrant a violent ambush and the question of self defense comes after.

@sean ajolo I thought so at first but now its unclear. He said something about what if his step mom was there according to someone else. But even if he wasn't disabled, calling someone out on doing something as deuchy as parking in a disabled parking space doesn't warrant a violent ambush and the question of self defense comes after.

@Finite Automata you mean the country that less than half the population controls and has controlled consistently for the last 50 years and has somehow been able to blame their mistakes on the rest of us like they weren't the ones pushing the bills that have financially ruined this country and also pushed mass incarceration? The country where when one side cheats it never gets investigated because they control both the media and all the major government bodies like the fbi, Cia, and homeland security? Guess what? I'm not on that side and I'm definitely not happy about it.  The rest of us believe in individual freedom so we can free ourselves of tyranny if we need to. The biggest reason the other side is able to control us so much is because they don't believe individual freedom is important nor do they believe tyranny is a bad thing. They believe they need to babysit and force their viewpoints on everybody else to get their perfect society and they try their best to accomplish it.

@The Seeker except he doesn't get shot until after he takes a step behind and towards him

@The Seeker except he doesn't get shot until after he takes a step behind and towards him

@Micheal Linne Confronting maybe not. Verbally abusing however. Fighting words often kills any self-defense claim because that IS in fact starting the incident.

@Micheal Linne Confronting maybe not. Verbally abusing however. Fighting words often kills any self-defense claim because that IS in fact starting the incident.

@Enter the Abyss As much as I believe he was in the wrong, I strongly disagree with your statement "If you start it and it escalates to the point you gotta shoot you are 100% at fault"

If I were to, hypothetically, complain to my neighbor about his mulberry tree making a mess on my lawn and he escalated the situation to potentially fatal violence, I would absolutely not be at fault to respond in turn.

@Enter the Abyss As much as I believe he was in the wrong, I strongly disagree with your statement "If you start it and it escalates to the point you gotta shoot you are 100% at fault"

If I were to, hypothetically, complain to my neighbor about his mulberry tree making a mess on my lawn and he escalated the situation to potentially fatal violence, I would absolutely not be at fault to respond in turn.

Yeah ...trying to get away why he already pushed him to the ground....he could have hit his head on the concrete...

Yeah ...trying to get away why he already pushed him to the ground....he could have hit his head on the concrete...

@Micheal Linne Man Idc what you say... you're still defending a murderer. Both were in the wrong and one got completely out of line. Period.

@Micheal Linne Man Idc what you say... you're still defending a murderer. Both were in the wrong and one got completely out of line. Period.

@Micheal Linne meh. Whatever you say big guy. You need glasses. The video shows a different story.

@Micheal Linne meh. Whatever you say big guy. You need glasses. The video shows a different story.

Wow, At first I was on the fence but you made me go back and oh my god, he was totally backing away after he pulled the gun. There were at least a couple seconds of little danger and he still shot him. What a worthless human being.

Wow, At first I was on the fence but you made me go back and oh my god, he was totally backing away after he pulled the gun. There were at least a couple seconds of little danger and he still shot him. What a worthless human being.

@Hooyahfish it didn't, it entered from the front left side of this guy's abdomen, it was more front than side and again he put a leg towards him, that's the angle that you expect in that situation.

@Hooyahfish it didn't, it entered from the front left side of this guy's abdomen, it was more front than side and again he put a leg towards him, that's the angle that you expect in that situation.

@Finite Automata Wow, look who's overgeneralizing an entire people and culture.

@Finite Automata Wow, look who's overgeneralizing an entire people and culture.

@Micheal Linne report it to the police or the store owners, no reason to go up to the car and take pictures like that and be confrontational.

@Micheal Linne report it to the police or the store owners, no reason to go up to the car and take pictures like that and be confrontational.

@Micheal Linne the victim walked away . There is no way to see someone walking away from you as walking towards you, it is literally the opposite direction. The shooter isn’t disabled, your arguments are flawed and bias. You appear to be grasping at straws.

@Micheal Linne the victim walked away . There is no way to see someone walking away from you as walking towards you, it is literally the opposite direction. The shooter isn’t disabled, your arguments are flawed and bias. You appear to be grasping at straws.

@End My Suffering Please except they didn't have placards and as far as we know he was just going to report them to the police until he was attacked. People illegally parking in disabled parking is despicable and should be reported every time.

@End My Suffering Please except they didn't have placards and as far as we know he was just going to report them to the police until he was attacked. People illegally parking in disabled parking is despicable and should be reported every time.

@brit instigated how? By confronting someone, who talked to him first btw, for being a deuchebag and parking in a handicap zone?

He wasn't yelling at them, he wasn't kicking the car or threatening them or calling them names, he was blindsided from behind, thrown to the ground and as he's pulling his gun out his attacker is stepping behind him and what easily appears to be in his direction and keeping his torso faced towards him and he shoots the guy that easily appears to be stepping towards him especially if you consider he was on the ground at this point, has to aim over his back as he's on his side and can only see the legs and upwards of this man that just attacked him. I think if you saw this from this man's point of view it would have looked like a step towards him to you. We can't help that he couldn't see from a good angle and couldn't see this man's feet.

@Micheal Linne if he was facing him, how did the bullet enter from the side? Hmm? 🤔

@Micheal Linne if he was facing him, how did the bullet enter from the side? Hmm? 🤔

@Micheal Linne it said only said one child came out the car so that means 2 or 3 kids were still<br> in the car by the time the mom was in the car?

@Micheal Linne it said only said one child came out the car so that means 2 or 3 kids were still
 in the car by the time the mom was in the car?

@Micheal Linne We have no confirmation of the disabilities of the child or the disabilities of the wife and/or husband who was shot dead. I don't believe that it's fair to assume that they are physically threatening considering that the guy was shoved for being pissy about a parking-space when we don't know anything about the others.

@Micheal Linne We have no confirmation of the disabilities of the child or the disabilities of the wife and/or husband who was shot dead. I don't believe that it's fair to assume that they are physically threatening considering that the guy was shoved for being pissy about a parking-space when we don't know anything about the others.

yeah. if he hadn't moved back, or actually took a step while the gun was out it would be different. But the step towards him was just before drawing the weapon - which in Michaels mind must have happened at the same time as he confused trying to take his gun out. <br>So if he was looking for oppurtunity to use his gun, or maybe wasn't as steady in a stressful situation as a gun owner really should be - I cannot judge. But he should not have shot him - the drawing seemed enough, otherwise a warning shot seems to have been quite enough even if Michael was extremely startled, confused and stressed in the situation. Just imho.

yeah. if he hadn't moved back, or actually took a step while the gun was out it would be different. But the step towards him was just before drawing the weapon - which in Michaels mind must have happened at the same time as he confused trying to take his gun out.
So if he was looking for oppurtunity to use his gun, or maybe wasn't as steady in a stressful situation as a gun owner really should be - I cannot judge. But he should not have shot him - the drawing seemed enough, otherwise a warning shot seems to have been quite enough even if Michael was extremely startled, confused and stressed in the situation. Just imho.

@Micheal Linne “you’re offended by mine” you’re shocked people aren’t peachy with you defending a murderer who instigated a confrontation, harassing a mother with children and then unlawfully abusing his legal weapon? the law isn’t even on your side.

@Micheal Linne “you’re offended by mine” you’re shocked people aren’t peachy with you defending a murderer who instigated a confrontation, harassing a mother with children and then unlawfully abusing his legal weapon? the law isn’t even on your side.

@Vilesentry we disagree, get over it. I think it was reasonable self defense, you think it was cold-blooded and calculated. At worst he made a mistake in my opinion.

@Vilesentry we disagree, get over it. I think it was reasonable self defense, you think it was cold-blooded and calculated. At worst he made a mistake in my opinion.

@Storm™ I didn't see the other two, my bad. I'm not offended by your view on this, you're offended by mine

@Storm™ I didn't see the other two, my bad. I'm not offended by your view on this, you're offended by mine

@Richard Morrow what part about this makes it racist?

@Richard Morrow what part about this makes it racist?

@Hooyahfish he was still facing him and he still stepped closer, especially from his viewpoint. We disagree about this let it go

@Hooyahfish he was still facing him and he still stepped closer, especially from his viewpoint. We disagree about this let it go

@Micheal Linne He was not disabled and also parking illegally.

@Micheal Linne He was not disabled and also parking illegally.

@Dawn Miskar I apparently didn't catch that part but that changes the entire context if that was in fact true.

@Dawn Miskar I apparently didn't catch that part but that changes the entire context if that was in fact true.

@Vilesentry and you had to make it about race even though literally no one else suggested it was racially motivated. That says more about you than this man

@Vilesentry and you had to make it about race even though literally no one else suggested it was racially motivated. That says more about you than this man

@Micheal Linne It wasn't self defense to shoot a man because he shoved him.

@Micheal Linne It wasn't self defense to shoot a man because he shoved him.

@Micheal Linne Oh yes, please, defend the guy who murdered a man in front of his family and then got off on a charge lighter than murder.

Smallest violin for the killer.

@Micheal Linne Oh yes, please, defend the guy who murdered a man in front of his family and then got off on a charge lighter than murder.

Smallest violin for the killer.

@Micheal Linne did you watch the video? The victim had three children. Oh, wait you're just here to be offended for, and defending someone being charged with manslaughter

@Micheal Linne did you watch the video? The victim had three children. Oh, wait you're just here to be offended for, and defending someone being charged with manslaughter

@Enter the Abyss He didnt say he wasnt at fault, he said the guy that got shot was also in the wrong, which he 100% was. he ASSAULTED a DISABLED PERSON

@Enter the Abyss He didnt say he wasnt at fault, he said the guy that got shot was also in the wrong, which he 100% was. he *ASSAULTED* a *DISABLED PERSON*

@Micheal Linne the fact that he was shot in the side means he wasn’t facing Michael when he shot him.
That’s all you need to know.

Stop talking.

@Micheal Linne the fact that he was shot in the side means he wasn’t facing Michael when he shot him.
That’s all you need to know.

Stop talking.

@Finite Automata they probably give sympathy for school shooters, as long as they've been bullied. Because clearly assault (without a threat to your life) is clearly an excuse to kill someone/s

@Finite Automata they probably give sympathy for school shooters, as long as they've been bullied. Because clearly assault (without a threat to your life) is clearly an excuse to kill someone/s

@Finite Automata killing somebody is life altering, and probably the most stressful thing imaginable, or one of. To me the average person, would want to avoid that senrio at all cost. I aslo wouldn't seek confrantations with people knowing I'm strapped, . I'd avoid that too.

@Finite Automata killing somebody is life altering, and probably the most stressful thing imaginable, or one of. To me the average person, would want to avoid that senrio at all cost. I aslo wouldn't seek confrantations with people knowing I'm strapped, . I'd avoid that too.

@Micheal Linne it seemed to me that it was 50/50 until the end where you find out he threatened people with his gun regularly. He was someone looking to use that gun.

@Micheal Linne it seemed to me that it was 50/50 until the end where you find out he threatened people with his gun regularly. He was someone looking to use that gun.

@Finite Automata false it is 100% acceptable to shoot if you feel threatened. That is how the law works.

@Finite Automata false it is 100% acceptable to shoot if you feel threatened. That is how the law works.

@Sleepy Frog false he made a jerk toward the guy prior to the shot.

@Sleepy Frog false he made a jerk toward the guy prior to the shot.

@Enter the Abyss only person starting stuff was the thug that pushed the guy down

@Enter the Abyss only person starting stuff was the thug that pushed the guy down

Lol you must be misinformed. It was clear he was wrong from the gate. ONCE SOMEONE STOPS BEING A THREAT YOU CAN NOT SHOT THEM!!!! Then claim self defense.

Lol you must be misinformed. It was clear he was wrong from the gate. ONCE SOMEONE STOPS BEING A THREAT YOU CAN NOT SHOT THEM!!!! Then claim self defense.

@Finite Automata And in "no other country" will you get shoved into the ground for telling someone to move away from a handicap spot either. Regardless of the verbal confrontation the man was having with the woman, shoving him into the ground for no other apparant reason than that is clearly very wrong

@Finite Automata And in "no other country" will you get shoved into the ground for telling someone to move away from a handicap spot either. Regardless of the verbal confrontation the man was having with the woman, shoving him into the ground for no other apparant reason than that is clearly very wrong

@Jude L It's a pet peeve. He goes there everyday, and sees it everyday. Telling someone to move shouldn't be a problem regardless.

@Jude L It's a pet peeve. He goes there everyday, and sees it everyday. Telling someone to move shouldn't be a problem regardless.

Hindsight is 20/20, try saying that while you've just been pushed into the ground probably in atleast a slight daze.

Hindsight is 20/20, try saying that while you've just been pushed into the ground probably in atleast a slight daze.

@Finite Automata also that "step to the side" was behind this guys back that he had to aim over and getting behind an armed person is exactly how someone who is about to rush you and wrestle your gun out of your hands to shoot you will choose to approach you.

@Finite Automata also that "step to the side" was behind this guys back that he had to aim over and getting behind an armed person is exactly how someone who is about to rush you and wrestle your gun out of your hands to shoot you will choose to approach you.

@Finite Automata there is no such thing as shooting to disable or disarm. When you have to shoot someone you shoot to kill or you fail to hit them. You don't have the right to defend yourself in other countries,  also, this has nothing to do with stand your ground laws, which remove the duty to retreat, because if you cannot get away you don't have a duty to retreat in the first place and he was on the ground aiming up at his attacker. Again you say he was retreating but you have a privileged point of view and self defense must only be seen as necessary from their point of view not the bystanders. If he could reasonably think that he was about to be attacked from his point of view, and he could, it would've looked like a step towards him from his point of view, then it should be self defense. The reason he was convicted is because people think he had enough time and a big enough field of view to determine his attacker was backing away but what they don't consider is that their point of view isn't his point view and that the 2.5s it took to draw the gun and shoot was 2 seconds of pulling it, half a second of aiming and seeing this man step towards him and a single moment of pulling the trigger.

@Micheal Linne He was backing up. End of story. He was rightfully convicted because of that. You're tilting at windmills

@Micheal Linne He was backing up. End of story. He was rightfully convicted because of that. You're tilting at windmills

@Sean O except he wasn't really yelling at a woman and her child, her kid was inside the store first of all and we're given no indication of shouting whatsoever. Again we disagree, that doesn't make you right, you're still not considering that his point of view is way worse than ours. I think from his point of view it would have looked like he was coming in to attack again

@Sean O except he wasn't really yelling at a woman and her child, her kid was inside the store first of all and we're given no indication of shouting whatsoever. Again we disagree, that doesn't make you right, you're still not considering that his point of view is way worse than ours. I think from his point of view it would have looked like he was coming in to attack again

@Jude L he didn't have his gun out for 2.5s. It took 2.5s from the time he reached for his gun until he fired it. 95% of that time was getting the gun out and aiming in his general direction

@Jude L he didn't have his gun out for 2.5s. It took 2.5s from the time he reached for his gun until he fired it. 95% of that time was getting the gun out and aiming in his general direction

@Micheal Linne I base it on your illogical comments and denial of reality.

@Micheal Linne I base it on your illogical comments and denial of reality.

Bro he literally slammed him into the ground the black guy was like a foot taller than him and had 60 pounds on him, he felt that his life was threatened so he shot. I guarantee that the black guy would have beat him further on the ground

Bro he literally slammed him into the ground the black guy was like a foot taller than him and had 60 pounds on him, he felt that his life was threatened so he shot. I guarantee that the black guy would have beat him further on the ground

@Finite Automata and you make that determination from a privileged point of view. Its skewed from being both after the fact and a much better point of view. People who hesitate die and from that man's point of view he did step towards him. You assume that man could somehow know that leg going towards him while his torso and head remained completely pointed towards him was just rotating so he could turn around but there is no way he could have known that especially when laying on the ground on his side aiming up over his back and unable to see his feet.

If you think that if someone who just shoved you to the ground from behind who as far as you can see is stepping in to attack you may not be attacking you and you should take the extra second to make sure than you are already being kicked and grappled and you are already fighting over your gun. If there is any sign they are coming in to attack you, you do not hesitate. It is you or them until you know otherwise and not the otherway around unless you would willingly die just to be sure you don't accidentally kill someone who attacked you and may or may not be trying to continue their assault.

@Micheal Linne thats true, but the surveillance footage clearly shows that the victim had no intention of further harming the suspect. He took three steps back as soon as the suspect reached for the gun and was turning to leave when the suspect shot. I don’t see how anyone could believe their life was in danger from a person who is turning to walk away from them. The suspect says that from the time he took out his gun and shot it was a split second, but there is at least a 2.5 second interval where the suspect has his gun trained on the victim before he shoots. During this tome, the victum is actively retreating. You could argue all day long that the suspect was so distraught that he couldn’t think straight enough to see that the victim was backing away, but he obviously was able to think straight enough to pull out his gun, aim, and kill this man.

@Finite Automata that is only from our perspective with the camera and still he was facing the man and stepped with his leg towards him in the video. And there's no way someone could have seen from the ground like that the direction his foot was facing so there's no way he could have known if it was turning to get away or turning to fight him. The camera gives you a privileged and biased view that he simply didn't have. That could have easily been seen as a step towards him and I think a lot of people would have made the same exact conclusion in fear for their life after being ambushed like that. This man probably isn't thinking at that moment that the guy that violently attacked him out of nowhere is going to run away especially if he moved his leg and hips in that man's direction like that.

@Jude L what he stated is a verbal threat against his life was never made. He never once said he felt secure that his life was not in danger, he said he was saving his ass and he thought he was facing getting kicked and beaten which kicking someone is deadly force btw, it is very easy to kill someone from kicking them.

@Jude L what he stated is a verbal threat against his life was never made. He never once said he felt secure that his life was not in danger, he said he was saving his ass and he thought he was facing getting kicked and beaten which kicking someone is deadly force btw, it is very easy to kill someone from kicking them.

@WAFFLE123 nobody is getting educated to use excessive force. They are taught that if your life is in danger defend yourself.

@WAFFLE123 nobody is getting educated to use excessive force. They are taught that if your life is in danger defend yourself.

@Micheal Linne In the video, you can see before he walks toward the driver window he stands in front of the car and seems to be gesturing and speaking. Its true, you cant be 100% sure who was the first to speak to the other but its easy to conclude that the man initiated the argument by parking (illegally, also) and walking around the womans car. The victum shouldn’t have started a physical fight but the suspect didn’t have to use excessive force. Its obvious that once the suspect pulled out the gun the victum immediately backed away, but the suspect still shot him. The suspect also did not state that he felt his life was in danger, he just thought he was going to be beaten and shot the man to “save his own ass” as he puts it. The suspect didnt shot in fear for his life, therefore it is not self defense.

He didn’t even have a weapon, and a step to the side is no reason to kill a man.

He didn’t even have a weapon, and a step to the side is no reason to kill a man.

@Jude L I'm not sure he initiated it. I don't know if you can tell but I definitely couldn't tell when that window came down so who talked to who first is up in the air in my opinion. The only thing we know is that his testimony that she rolled down her window and talked to him first was contested in court and I actually think this video takes a biased view in that woman's favor because even though it wasn't something that was established the narrator spoke as though it was established he had spoken to her first. It could have very easily ended with him taking pictures of the license plate and the handicap parking spot in my opinion especially if she was the one to call out to him and not the other way around but also even if he had talked to her first, it's no more inherently dangerous than seeing someone shoplifting and calling them out on it. Being shoved to the ground from behind definitely wasn't foreseeable especially since it didn't even look like a heated argument or anything. I still think it should be self defense

@Micheal Linne at the beginning of the Interrogation the detective asks if the handicap spot being occupied effects the suspect and he says “if my mother in law pulled into the parking lot then yes” and he never said anything about being disabled so I dont know where you got that from? Clearly the family shouldnt have parked in the handicap spot but the man did not need to harass the woman in the car about it. He initiated an argument when he could have just made a report to the police instead.

@Micheal Linne at the beginning of the Interrogation the detective asks if the handicap spot being occupied effects the suspect and he says “if my mother in law pulled into the parking lot then yes” and he never said anything about being disabled so I dont know where you got that from? Clearly the family shouldnt have parked in the handicap spot but the man did not need to harass the woman in the car about it. He initiated an argument when he could have just made a report to the police instead.

@Micheal Linne all I can say is watch the video .. it completely lays your argument to rest. And for the record.. this “disabled” man is not visibly disabled so no one would know that unless he told them

@Micheal Linne all I can say is watch the video .. it completely lays your argument to rest. And for the record.. this “disabled” man is not visibly disabled so no one would know that unless he told them

@0xbowman yeah, especially when it comes to self defense.

@0xbowman yeah, especially when it comes to self defense.

@Lewis McCombe you don't have that time to take. He was facing him and did take a step forward in that video in my opinion. It doesn't matter if someone took 2 steps back right before, that happens in fights all the time but as soon as he took that leading step forward and was facing him that was enough to honestly believe he was in a fighting position and was going to beat that disabled man right there.

People talk about the 21 foot rule and mention it's meant for knife wielders but that man was considerably closer, was essentially within 5 feet and within plenty of range to lunge and kick that man and start a struggle over the gun which could have easily ended in the disabled man's death. You can't wait for the lunge, as soon as that man took that step forward, even if he took 2 steps back first, he was a threat and that's exactly when he was shot and that disabled man had just barely got his bearings and hold on the gun not giving him enough time to have even seen that man take 2 steps back.

@Micheal Linne you are arguing eith idiots. They seem to be so confident in a broken “justice system”. Clearly they dont realize you in fact guilty til proven innocent

@Micheal Linne you are arguing eith idiots. They seem to be so confident in a broken “justice system”. Clearly they dont realize you in fact guilty til proven innocent

@Micheal Linne  Dude gets pushed over, pulls a gun, doesn't take enough time to assess the situation, (didn't even look at the guys hands or face,) kills someone who was moving away.

@Micheal Linne  Dude gets pushed over, pulls a gun, doesn't take enough time to assess the situation, (didn't even look at the guys hands or face,) kills someone who was moving away.

@Sleepy Frog he stopped stepping back and did take a step closer while facing this man

@Sleepy Frog he stopped stepping back and did take a step closer while facing this man

@Enter the Abyss that's where you're wrong. Confronting someone isn't illegal and even if he had been provoking violence by saying racial expletives it still would have been self defense so long as he didn't start that altercation with violence or a serious and inherently dangerous crime. The violence started when that man pushed a disabled man off his feet essentially for confronting his wife about a crime they were committing  and it wasn't just none of this man's business because it was a crime that directly effected him as he was disabled and when people so nonchalantly park illegally in those disabled parking spaces they are taking those spaces from people who need them.

I never once said having a gun gives you the right to shoot nor did I say being disabled did. What I did say was it's not like this guy had his back to this man, he had one foot towards him and was facing towards him, there was no way to know in my opinion if that guy was going to try to continue beating this disabled man or actually turn away and run until after he'd already been shot but when your attacker is that close it's easy to see why you'd be in a mindset of I either shoot or I risk this continuing and getting beaten to death.

at 2:29 the gun is pulled and you see the victim start to step backwards and away, at 2:31 the shot is fired. Only a few seconds but you can see that the victim was clearly trying to retreat from the situation before he was shot. There was no present threat when the gun was fired.

at 2:29 the gun is pulled and you see the victim start to step backwards and away, at 2:31 the shot is fired. Only a few seconds but you can see that the victim was clearly trying to retreat from the situation before he was shot. There was no present threat when the gun was fired.

@Micheal Linne bro having a gun or being disabled doesn't give him a right to start some shit and then shoot when the shit escalates. If you start it and it escalates to the point you gotta shoot you are 100% at fault

@Micheal Linne bro having a gun or being disabled doesn't give him a right to start some shit and then shoot when the shit escalates. If you start it and it escalates to the point you gotta shoot you are 100% at fault

@DankEngine like bro was in the wrong when he illegally parked and then wanted to harass somebody else about parking in the handicap space

@DankEngine like bro was in the wrong when he illegally parked and then wanted to harass somebody else about parking in the handicap space

I kinda thought he was wrong from the beginning. He said he guy pushed him and nothing else. There was no threat of death or major bodily harm.

I kinda thought he was wrong from the beginning. He said he guy pushed him and nothing else. There was no threat of death or major bodily harm.


My husband is a quadriplegic in a wheelchair, and uses a lift that requires handicap parking. Typically people that misuse handicap spots do so because theyre in a hurry, and not malicious.  Sometimes I just park right behind them perpendicularly and slowly take my time unloading my husband.  My hope is that I slow them down enough to make them think about thier choices next time. Maybe seeing a helpless man being loaded or unloaded from a handicap van might show them another perspective.  But I damn sure am not gonna kill or hurt someone over a parking spot.

I love the fact that you take care of your husband. Gives me faith in humanity

I love the fact that you take care of your husband. Gives me faith in humanity

In Washington that would be considered unlawful imprisonment the person would be legally allowed to shoot you at your husband

@Rich Schnippel The situation was very specific  , and both parties acted inappropriately . (Killing person too far ) usually happens a lot watching cinema being annoying angering other party the killing them because they attacked him .

Micheale Currin  he was arguing from a good distance away, he couldn't have hurt her in the car anyway. Marquez could have come out and confronted Drejka, instead he assaults him from behind, and though the arm injury seems to have been fake, he could have very well shattered his arm, broken his hip, his leg, or caused any kind of other injury because he was arguing over a parking spot. His first act is violence, so I doubt he would have stopped after just pushing him. <br>I'm not trying to defend Drejka, but Marquez was just as stupid here

Micheale Currin  he was arguing from a good distance away, he couldn't have hurt her in the car anyway. Marquez could have come out and confronted Drejka, instead he assaults him from behind, and though the arm injury seems to have been fake, he could have very well shattered his arm, broken his hip, his leg, or caused any kind of other injury because he was arguing over a parking spot. His first act is violence, so I doubt he would have stopped after just pushing him.
I'm not trying to defend Drejka, but Marquez was just as stupid here

@YOU
    ⬋
༼ ༼ ༼  ⃝ꅟ𓂺⬅ME if someone is verbally arguing with your wife or significant other in a distance .. is ok to slam them to the floor out of nowhere instead of saying hey what’s going on or saying something to stop it or deescalate the situation like a normal person?! If he couldn’t do that than the guy who shot him couldn’t either. Both were wrong.

He def wasn’t intending to kill anyone over a handicap spot , it was after he got push and slammed to the floor , in my eyes he defended himself. The guy should of never put his hands on him. You do that and what happens after is a consequence. Period.

If he really was annoyed or concerned about the spot he would have politely ask the woman in the car to tell his husband or whoever was driving to be mindful where he parks next time and see if there's a way to move the car (spare key or if it's going to take a while maybe go get the keys and move it), that was not the issue. The issue is that he wanted to start a fight and feel superior in some way, then he got physically attacked and because he is a coward pull out he is gone and on top of that he was waiting to any excuse to use it so he did

Till an angry man comes out and pushes your husband out of his wheelchair onto the ground...  Then starts to kick him on the ground into a bloody mess and he wishes he had a gun for self-defense but didn't and ends up handicap and now many injuries.<br>I think both parties messed up big time, so not taking sides.  But fact is this man with his family would still be alive if he didn't come out resorting to violence first off and the other man didn't need to pull the trigger but was in-line to have his gun out and aimed and if further aggression, I'd imagine their would be no prison time.  Lack of consideration for handicap(general lack of consideration too) is annoying and I actually respect the man going up to the car and his first initial complaints, it's just he took it too far at the end with the gun shot.

Till an angry man comes out and pushes your husband out of his wheelchair onto the ground...  Then starts to kick him on the ground into a bloody mess and he wishes he had a gun for self-defense but didn't and ends up handicap and now many injuries.
I think both parties messed up big time, so not taking sides.  But fact is this man with his family would still be alive if he didn't come out resorting to violence first off and the other man didn't need to pull the trigger but was in-line to have his gun out and aimed and if further aggression, I'd imagine their would be no prison time.  Lack of consideration for handicap(general lack of consideration too) is annoying and I actually respect the man going up to the car and his first initial complaints, it's just he took it too far at the end with the gun shot.

If there is someone in or near the car I walk upto the car and flick my flashlight on and off on my phone too pretend I've taken a photo, 8/10 times they move within 2 mins if they see me, the other 2 times they freak out and ask me to delete the photo 🤣

@YOU
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༼ ༼ ༼  ⃝ꅟ𓂺⬅ME you don't put hands on people ..personally I wouldn't shoot someone,  but I am not the type who gets hands put on him( not saying I'm a tough guy , but I try to just live and let live) , but when you put your hands on people especially smaller people than you are taking a huge risk

I think it’s about reasonableness. If there’s a lot of free spots and someone is in a rush I’ll give them a pass. It’s just about being considerate to others

yeah so you park and intentionally slow down someone who isn't trying to take up a spot for very long? That makes you just as petty as the person you are talking about. 99% of the time handicapped parking spots don't even get used so if I gotta take up that spot for 30 seconds I don't feel bad about it. I find it irritating that all the good parking spots up front and close are almost always empty.

@Nikita Zagorodniy yeah OK then keyboard warrior 🤣 this is why Murica needs gun regulation. Y’all are crazy AF

Parking in a handicapped space without permit IS malicious regardless of the justification or reasoning.

Parking in a handicapped space without permit IS malicious regardless of the justification or reasoning.

@Girish Gopal Its emotions, its emotions simply because if something like that has not happened before there is no way to prepare for it.  Some people are better able to deal with pressure.

This guy deserves 15 years in prison for killing. But being physically assaulted with intent to be harmed, thats not ok.

You just never know,  my theory is to continue on my errand and bitch about it later to my husband... If I were with a genuinely handicapped person I would probably tell the clerk.

@Saltcor I think when you try and reverse the race in this situation it’s hard to say what exactly would happen. Especially since I see that you’re trying to make a point so obviously you’re going to state what you’d expect others to comment. If in fact this did happen, it would be reverse racism.

Would you expect to be pushed to the ground if you did decide to explain why someone shouldn’t park in a handicap spot?  I think there’s no question this was manslaughter...but I also think the man would be alive if he didn’t attack the man in the first place.  Personally, I don’t think it’s his job to police the parking lot...but he did.

No the correct way is to mag dump into the car yelling about disabled stickers!

No the correct way is to mag dump into the car yelling about disabled stickers!

That sounds kinda humiliating for your husband

That sounds kinda humiliating for your husband

He didn't kill him over the spot but because the clown out of nowhere comes out and pushes him I woulda beat tf outta that clown for doing that tf he think he is

@YOU
    ⬋
༼ ༼ ༼  ⃝ꅟ𓂺⬅ME if somebody's arguing with your wife are you going to push them down to the ground

@YOU
    ⬋
༼ ༼ ༼  ⃝ꅟ𓂺⬅ME if somebody's arguing with your wife are you going to push them down to the ground

NYC we mind our own business and smile a lot.

NYC we mind our own business and smile a lot.

Better to be fined than to lose your husband right? I completely agree. That family didn't deserve what happened to them.

Do you think it’s wise to escalate a situation or cause confrontation when you have a handicapped spouse? Does it make your day better?

That’s the most profound learning lesson. Can’t say I’ve ever parked in a handicap spot(usually park farthest away from cars as possible so no one hits my car). Lol <br>Bless you for being so damn patient and a better person then me cause I know If I was in your shoes there’s no way I’d handle it as mature as you do.

That’s the most profound learning lesson. Can’t say I’ve ever parked in a handicap spot(usually park farthest away from cars as possible so no one hits my car). Lol
Bless you for being so damn patient and a better person then me cause I know If I was in your shoes there’s no way I’d handle it as mature as you do.

This dude definitely deserved to go to prison and that dude didn’t deserve to get shot. However, if this had been a black guy shooting a white guy in the same situation, this comment section would have A LOT more “they shouldn’t have parked handicap” or “he shouldn’t have shoved them to the ground” because it’s completely okay to hate white people purely for the color of their skin.

yeah whenever my dad parks in one I always remind him but he always makes sure that whatever he does he does it fast. we never go into an actual store while in a handicapped parking its usually a convenience store or the cleaners

I also have had this problem before when people yell at my mother in a wheelchair asking if they could move to the next spot. If I was older at that time I would also be charged with manslaughter.

The problem with boxing them in is the same ignorant jerk who parks in the handicap spot is sometimes the same ignorant jerk that will shoot you for boxing him in.  I wouldn't take that risk if I was concerned about my spouses safety.

You are brilliant. That is the best solution to this problem Ive ever heard

You are brilliant. That is the best solution to this problem Ive ever heard

Bless you for loving your husband and helping him through his struggle. Being a quadriplegic must be a nightmare, it is good that he has you to help care for him.

@Unfriendly Black Hottie It's really hard to think right when meeting this kind of situation, he just pushed him showing maybe his anger towards this man's wrong decision to occupy the space wc suppose only for disable person, but the reaction was too much, to take someone's life for such a senseless reason

@Girish Gopal dude pushed him because he was getting aggressive with his girlfriend. How was he to know if that coward was going to lay hands on her or not? He defended his woman as he should have.

@Girish Gopal the guy was already walking away????

@Girish Gopal the guy was already walking away????

He didn't shot him for parking wtf !!! r u saying, he shot him because he thought that guy was gonna fck him up, he was arguing with that women from a good distance it was her husband who thought its ok to assault a man just because he was bigger than him imagine if that man was an officer on duty would he do that NOOOOOO he would talk first .. so why did he  assault him??

I mean he didn't kill anyone over taking up a handicap spot, he did so over being pushed to the ground. Everything he's done was perfectly fine and justified, until he pulled the trigger.

Love your comment. Good judgement. No one deserves to die over something that can be fixed. I don't like people who park in a disabled lot but we can't solve that with violence.